I have so far refrained from commenting on the woman who just gave birth to eight children. You know, the one who already has six others at home. Who is, according to media reports, young, unmarried, and living with her parents.
But after I just heard a news report in which this young woman's mother admits her daughter is obsessed with having babies? Well, I can no longer hold back from writing what the Pirate calls one of my Offend Everybody Posts.
I really have only one question: if we the people are so yippy skippy to legislate every little thing in the universe, why the heck fire do we la, la, la, la, la ourselves when it comes to the fertility industry? Oh, riiiiiiiiiiiiight, because God says go forth and and multiply. And get rich doing it.
This isn't a miracle. It's madness.
30 comments:
...because the vast majority of people using fertility services aren't freakin' insane.
...because to stop this you'd have to legislate something like "You can do artificial, but you have to cull down to no more than 3 babies." Yea. State mandated abortion!
I think what you have here is a crazy aberration that isn't cause for the government to get involved.
My question is, who's paying for her to get pregnant this way?
I think she might be a muslib too.
FoxNews (real news, fair-and-balanced) calculated the first-year cost of the octuplets at 1.85 million. Prolly borne by taxpayers.
I ain't big on the Fed Gub'ment regulatizing industries but a simple ONE-EGG-AT-A-TIME policy might be in order.
P.S.
One-Egg-At-A-Time would eliminate Gnome's mandated abortion concern.
Britain has a Two-Egg-Maximum policy, so it's been done.
yeah, I hear ya on this, iffin' youse sayin' no more fertility implants on folks wif' a couple of kids already. These idjit "scientists" get a charge outa usin' some poor sop of woman to try their whacko experiments.
I refer you to Aunty's Mute Monday of this week--the human/ pig woman an' babies sculpture? Gag. BUT, the "scientists" refuse to put ethical limits on they ownselves--oh but you know! Gosh! IT's all fer a good cause--din't Michael J Fox tell you so? It ain't NEVER ethical to splice and dice a living embryo to test yore pet theories.
Stem cells from under the baby teeth, or umbilical cords--sure, from extracted living embryos? No no no.
Wait! I'se off topic now--ter git back to the baby fertilizin' bidness--let's us'uns not hang this on God. He din't say NUTHIN'
'bout no messin' wif' the natural way of thangs--such as this ain't God's M.O. a'tall. This is pure scientific hubris and a pitiful disturbed woman, methinks, Moi.
Have as many as you can afford. And if that's zero, then don't have any.
Limiting the eggs is problematic too.
The procedure is very expensive and limiting to 1 would mean that very often you'd have to do it several times to end up with 1 child.
I can see limiting to 3 perhaps...or whatever can be determined to be cost effective.
Gnome: I don't mandate state involvement, either. I'm just pointing out the irony of how gub'ment is all up in our bidness EXCEPT in this area.
Troll: One shot you mean?
Aunty: Just pointing out the irony of folks who use God as an excuse in this instance, but then forget about the fact there might be natural order at work, too.
MilkRiver: Welcome to Moi's Blob! Well, yes, that makes sense. But who determines what "afford" is, especially in cases like this? My brain is reeling at the cost to taxpayers to support these 14 children. 'Cause what job in the universe can afford this?
Gnome: I'm not advocating limits, either. But you'd think a simple home check and psyche eval would be in order at least . . .
Having many friends who have felt the need to go down the path to fertility help, I'm confuzzled at how to fix this problem. I think I blame the Doctor who implanted eight eggs. A woman's body isn't built to carry more than one or two, safely. So THAT is the person in this case who was irresponsible. Ferility is big business and therefore no one is "vetting" the "customers" (not patients in my mind.) In so many ways I believe that if your body isn't able to bear children, then you find other ways to enrich your life and the life of others not so fortunate.
My SIL is going through this now.
She'll be a great mom if it works. They've implanted 3 and I know she will "reduce" to 1 or 2 if they all three take.
I find "reducing" hard to accept.
I look at my children and have to ask myself, "Which one would have been 'reduced' under similar circumstances.
This would be a problem if she is going to go on welfare but surely she will pimp the kids out to make a reality series? A sick idea but obviously has been done in the current TV reality show: Jon and Kate Plus 8
This is certainly an extreme case of fertility medicine gone totally unregulated and out of control but I find it less distasteful than the numerous parents who abuse their kids and are really shit parents generally who really should never have been allowed to conceive before understanding what exactly the responsibilities are of being a parent.
Ah...the key here might be Boxer's phrase, "fertility bidness".
EGGSactly.
When it was medicine, there might o' been some restraint, but bidness makes it a whole other fish.
I'se wif' Gnomey (who needs to blog again!) "reduction" is a horror. Two implants is tops.
Aunty Belle (who ain't signed in)
This is an absolutely fascinating discussion. It seems that folks are upset that she's having more babies that is accepted as "natural" or at least in the rarest of cirmcumstances. I also get a sense that folks want to force the doctors/fertility specialists to prevent this from happening again yet we all know that would be a very difficult thing to get passed at any state or federal level. But we're also talking ethics. Ethics of doctors and the ethics of the mother who it sounds like currently can't provide for the children she already has. But isn't also the ethics of science who sidestep the inability of a woman's body to produce offspring? Is adoption so abhorent that you would spend the time and money AND the possibility of selective reduction just to conceive a child of your own genetic material? I see a massive slippery slope ahead of more government in our bidness as Moi says. I certainly don't want to pay for the care and feeding of this woman's now massive and extremely exspensive offspring but if you're going to limit her ability to do this again, gird your loins for a baby battle royale.
Boxer: Well put. And, I wonder why more folks don't take the adoption option. It's heartbreaking, how many unwanted children languish in foster care and orphanages.
Gnome: "Reduction" is actually the word used? Shiver.
Emma: Bwahahahaha! Reality series. Of course! Seriously, though, as I battle between my live and let live philosophy and the one that sneakingly suspects we're all morons in need of corralling, I'm temped to craft a "You Shouldn't Be a Parent If . . . " test.
Aunty: And are the docs who usher these things through going to care for these babies?
They use the word "reduction" over "aborting" because THAT would be somewhat counter-productive wouldn't it?
It's a very strange world we live in.
Shamu: Perfectly said, especially your point about the "ethics" of ignoring infertility. An aberration or natural population control? Are we still operating on Cro Magnon genes to such an extent that our desire to reproduce is a compulsion and not a choice?
Boxer: Yes, the inability to call a thing by its true name is the utmost in cowardice.
AARGHHH! I so want to comment on this, but it's hard since I use my real name. Let's just say that I know a person who has a fertility clinic as a customer. And let's just say that this person, an honest, hardworking man, was accused by one of the fertility doctors of trying to rip him off (he wasn't) after providing a service related to the operation of his office. I just thought that was ironic, when said fertility doc takes hundreds of thousands of dollars from patients who are desperate to conceive, yet provides no money-back guarantees if his techniques fail.
The doctor needs to be investigated. Surely some sort of background check is done before someone wants to do this type of thing??? I guess she could have been sleeping around and had them year-after-year the old fashioned way ;)
Wendy & Pam: Speaking of fertility doc culpability. Those babies will be staying in the hospital for 2-3 months before going home. Who's picking up the tab for that, I wonder? The broke-ass state of California?
Maybe Bragalina will adopt them...
I have no idea what I want to say here. So this'll be kind of random.
Years ago, 18-year-old girl is turned out of local Methodist Children's Home (in Decatur, K9) because of age limits. Associate pastor at my wife's church convinces us to let her stay at our home . . . without telling us (to protect the girl's privacy) that the girl has Borderline Personality Disorder, a history of sexual abuse allegations against older males (teachers, coaches, etc.), theft, suicide attempts, and so on. Our sons were roughly 8 and 5 at the time. Did these nice, churchgoing (nonMuslim) friends of ours consider, well, us? We finally throw her out after finding out she was stealing from some friends of ours (still before we found out any of the above). We keep in touch with her for a few years because we didn't really hold her problems against her and because we felt some compassion for her. Eventually she decided to have a kid. What are you supposed to do?
Yeah, government sucks. It's made up of people, and elected officials are elected for the most part by people who I wouldn't let run an elevator for me. An awful lot of people suck.
Yeah, a lot of churches suck, too. They think right to life is a great idea, straight up until the time you're born. Then, not so much. Then, well, you're pretty much on your own, and all things are equal in our great American society for anyone who wants to live the American Dream. Uh-huh. Until you realize that de facto, economic segregation has far worse effects on our society than de jure segregation. And ironically, it turns out that one of the churches I've always abhorred is ending up with one of the best true right-to-life (after birth) plans out there -- as far as protecting the poor, being antiwar, anti-death penalty (which I kind of waver on, but I admire their consistency).
Year, a lot of parents suck. And so do a lot of kids. And good parents don't always produce good kids, and bad parents don't always produce bad kids. The equation's just not that simple.
Nor are the answers. Not to this. Not to the government's problems. Not to anything.
Should this idiot have 14 children? What stupid doctors signed on for this ride? Are they all going to sell their stories, too? I wish good, loving homes could be found for every single one of her kids, and this fool be put on some heavy medication and kept out of everyone's hair for the rest of her born days. Frankly, I'm looking for the same out myself right about now. Send all your unused mindnumbing chemicals to me c/o moi. She knows where to find me.
Shamu: And buy them all mini Bottega Veneta bags!
Czar: I'm assuming by now that everyone knows I was being ironic when I puzzled over governmental regulation of this issue. I'm not for it. As you point out, people are people. Living free means living with morons, and the consequences of their actions. Do I like it? No. Would I not make things all better for my particular world view if given a magic wand? You bet. Who wouldn't.
My point here simply is this: WTF is UP with the clinic/docs who implanted this woman with 8 freakin' eggs? Why aren't they being investigated by the AMA? Surely they have broken some kind of code to do no harm?
Because this woman seems mentally ill to me. It is a perfectly normal, human impulse, this desire to form a close, loving family unit with another person and to make children part of that unit. What I do not understand is the craving to breed beyond all logic. Whether biological or pathological, it makes no difference. That kind of decision has impact on the rest of society's civil rights, not to mention an economic and psychological impact on the remaining members of the family.
That seems to be the case here, yet none of the doctors – perhaps in their blindness for moohla – addressed the issue. If we want gooberment out of our lives, then we're going to have to do a better job of policing our own actions, Party People. As Shamu pointed out, can you imagine what kind of legislation some busy body bee in Congress might be crafting to deal with this in the future? I shudder to think.
Oh, and P.S.: I appreciate your point regarding who takes care of the children we do convince women to carry to term. It is certainly fodder for thought and discuss, but not here.
MOI!
PLEASE come back to the Front Porch--I added a twist --aq contenst--come hep me!!!
(BTW, great final comment--uh, yeah! the doc is the villan in this--that poor woman is disturbed an' has a need fer attention, the doc took advantage of her)
Memo to Gnomeself: I'se feelin' neglected. An' ya doan even have yore own blob no more so I can come holler at ya'.
As a therapist and parent-educator, I was pretty disturbed by that revelation too. Everyone thinks it's their "right" to procreate; but we've well-established that your rights end where mine begin. If I'm a helpless infant who is neglected because my mother is unable to care for me properly, that's where your rights "end". Check out "parentsbehavingbadly.com" - there's a lot of stuff there about parents who should not have had children!
Somebody should have gotten her some dolls.
i heard the grandparents were cuttin' bait and bailing on daughter.
how dare ya'll question her right to reproduce!
meanwhile in oregon they want to fit all new cars with a GPS/computer thingy that tallies your milage so they can -what else? -tax you for it. grrherhahahahaha
i think we can prosecute this multi-egg receptacle with massive carbon taxes. 14 babies farting and exhaling surely is as damaging as the farm animals they are proposing to tax (yes. its TRUE)
you shouldnt f*ck with mother nature.
who is going to watch a show about these people?
ahhhhhhh - not too worry. they'll all be in FEMA camps soon.
Pretty insane in my book.
Moi...actually the nutzoid physician who did this is going to be relieved of his medical license. She did not have 8 babies due to fertility drugs....the QUACK doctor implanted 8 embryos!
Uh....I believe the ethics of this type of practice requires careful screening...THIS mother certainly does not meet the profiles and should have been rejected, and there is some concern the doctor USED this stupid, stupid woman to get the Guiness or Ripley's record for the greatest number of birthed implanted embryos.
( Not surviving, 'birthed')
This is INSANE and no doubt it will cost the USA a couple of million dollars per one pound premie to get them to even a 50% chance of life. AND....the medicos are lying by saying the babies are not on 'respirators'... cause they are on 'ventilators'.
Government cannot be allowed to legislate free choice on an individuals reproductive rights
( We aren't China...yet) HOWEVER, we have existing laws governing medical practices regarding these types of issues... and this doc should be prosecuted to the max.AND, the royalties from his tell all book should go to the babies.
GeekGirl: Thank you for saying that so plainly. I couldn't agree more. The problem, however, becomes: who decides?
WTWA: Or introduced her to the joys of SHOE SHOPPING.
K9: Al Gore's gonna stick her with a carbon tax! Bwahahahahahaha! I laugh now, but wait . . . it could happen.
Heff: Welcome to Cloud Kookoo Land. Hope you brought some magazines, it's gonna be a long-ass ride.
Fishy: Certainly, we can have laws governing this kind of behavior that don't infringe on reproductive "rights." Again, whatever those rights happen to be. Personally, I don't see why the state of CA doesn't bring the mother up on child neglect charges. One of those octuplets weighs only a pound and a half.
Ehhh - she can just sell them all and get loads of money can't she?
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